Libya: The Red-Mist Makers

The AC-130's 105mm howitzer / DoD photo

Once you’ve declared that no U.S. combat boots will be on Libyan soil, you do the next best thing: send in aerial ground-pounders. After more than a week of high-flying B-2s, F-15s and F-16s, the Pentagon has begun flying a very different kind of warplane over Libya in recent days.

The A-10 Warthog (not its official name, which is the Thunderbolt II) and the AC-130U Spooky gunship, which boasts a fearsome 105mm cannon hanging out its side, are designed to turn enemy troops into red mist after destroying their armor. “I’m not going to talk about specifically how any of the weapons systems are being employed,” Vice Adm. William Gortney, director of the Pentagon’s Joint Staff, said Monday when asked how the two are now being used over Libya. “They’re combat aircraft, and they deliver a precision effect.”

The A-10 was the first aircraft developed by the U.S. Air Force to support troops on the ground, and is basically a flying GAU-8 Avenger heavy automatic cannon with wings. The seven-barrel gun fires close to 4,000  four-inch long shells a minute — 65 a second. It generally carries about 1,200 rounds, meaning it can fire nonstop for less than 20 seconds. From 4,000 feet, it can put 80 percent of its fire within a 40-foot circle. The gun packs a recoil with five tons of force, which actually slows the airplane down in flight.

In addition to a pair of relatively small-bore cannon, the AC-130′s real punch comes from its 105mm howitzer, which fires a round more than four inches in diameter. These side-mounted weapons employ high-tech radars, video and infrared devices to pinpoint their targets and destroy them with a single direct shot or so-called saturation fire. The venerable M-102 howitzer fired from the belly of the beast generally takes off with 96 rounds. The AC-130U tends to fly lazy orbits at about 10,000 feet, circling its prey — at night.

Related Topics: a-10, ac-130, National Security
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  • michaelfury

    “Red mist”, Mr. Thompson?

    Why don’t you just warn the Libyan women not to have children?

    http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2010/11/11/circle-ix/

  • nflfoghorn

    “… The AC-130U tends to fly lazy orbits at about 10,000 feet, circling its prey — at night”
    .
    I’m not watching a show on Nat Geo, am I?

  • square1

    We had to destroy the peace in order to make it.

  • http://grapemusing.blogspot.com/ grape_crush

    Nothing goes along with my lunch better than a shot of military fetishism.

  • polaris111

    “Red mist makers”.

    Agree with Mike. Stupid, gross and typical. Easy for a columnist to write, but it will change you forever if you saw it happen.

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    Why does a supposedly reputable news publication allow for euphemisms like “red mist” and for this almost gleeful toy collector tone when describing weapons?

  • paulejb

    Ladies & Gentlemen,

    Exactly what did you people expect would happen once Obama “let slip the dogs of war?” Did you think it would be a bloodless effort. War is not a video game, people. And no one does war better than the US Military.

  • michaelfury

    Ask your friends in the Pentagon to reassure us they are using tungsten penetrators, Mr. Thompson.

    But then who gives a f*ck about the air, soil and water as long as the oil is safe to drink, right?

    http://michaelfury.wordpress.com/2010/06/23/by-their-fruits/

  • allthingsinaname

    How are those jobs coming along? Has your paycheck increased in say the last 10 years? Really.

  • paulejb

    allthings…@9,
    .
    It has if you are a public employee. In the private sector probably not so much.

  • bobell

    I’m a public employee. My pay over the past ten years has increased in nominal dollar terms but has dropped when adjusted for inflation, It’s now frozen, in dollar terms, for at least two years, which means that it will drop further in real terms unless deflation sets in, in which case we’ll all have much bigger worries than pay raises or cuts.
    .
    I can live with things as they are, but there are lots of people for whom it’s going to be a hardship. And there are lots more who have no jobs of any kind. I seem to recall the Republican candidates last fall promising to give top priority to job creation — or was that just a dream?

  • newfreedomblog

    I seem to recall the Democrats last fall promising to give top priority to job creation — or was that just a dream?

    .
    There fixed it for ya!!
    .
    Oh and who was in charge and still in charge to this very day? Yes you got it……(ding ding ding)….DemocRATS

  • newfreedomblog

    “Sen. Charles Schumer, D-N.Y., a member of the Democratic Senate leadership, got on a conference call with reporters Tuesday morning without realizing the reporters were already listening in. Schumer thought he was on a private line with four Democratic senators who were to talk with reporters about the current budget stalemate.
    .
    Schumer instructed the group, made up of Sens. Barbara Boxer of California, Tom Carper of Delaware, Ben Cardin of Maryland and Richard Blumenthal of Connecticut, to tell reporters that the GOP is refusing to negotiate.
    .
    He told the group to make sure they label the GOP spending cuts as “extreme.”
    .
    “I always use extreme, Schumer said. “That is what the caucus instructed me to use.”

    .
    http://washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/2011/03/schumer-coordinates-dem-budget-attack-gop
    .
    Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

  • nflfoghorn

    Paulie, this is further proof that you have no understanding (or willful igorance) of facts. WI, OH, IN, FL, PA and MI all have Repub governors and legislatures who believe public employees have gotten 10% raises each year for the past five years, that THEY (workers) have been the main reason why our country is still pulling itself out of a recession.

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    I think we all knew that, which is why we would hope that Thompson would write more soberly and respectfully about such matters.

  • nflfoghorn

    More to topic, I think MT is saying to us that it’ll take more than just cruise missles to have the desired effect IF we’re intent on not placing troops on the ground.

  • squirmz

    I’m sorry but I drool over the A-10.

  • gysgt213

    “It has if you are a public employee. In the private sector probably not so much.”
    .
    If only private employees had some way together and bargan for their pay and benefits they might be doing better.

  • nflfoghorn

    The stuff comic book–er, video game legend, for sure.

  • hippooath

    “War is not a video game”
    .
    Red mist is a poetic video game term – not what the gun does to a human which is smear of flesh. So yeah – maybe we’re asking for a non punk term for the devastating effect of war.

  • paulejb

    bobell@9.2,
    .
    How much do you contribute to your health insurance? Pension? Did your pay decrease in any of the last 10 years? Were you laid off at any time?

  • paulejb

    nflfoghorn@9.4,
    .
    See 9.6.
    .
    Public employees for too long have been immunized from downturns of the economy at the expense of taxpayers. That time is done.

  • paulejb

    gysgt213@9.5,
    .
    Union membership in the private sector has been declining for decades. If workers were interested in union representation they would have it.

  • paulejb

    hippooath@7.2,
    .
    How about slaughter? Will that suit?

  • pintortwo

    Vice Adm. William Gortney:. “They’re combat aircraft, and they deliver a precision effect“.
    .
    versus
    .
    “The seven-barrel gun fires close to 4,000 four-inch long shells a minute — 65 a second. It generally carries about 1,200 rounds… From 4,000 feet, it can put 80 percent of its fire within a 40-foot circle.”
    .
    These warplanes are going to be used to attack ground forces in and around cities.. and 80% of its rounds strike withing a 40 ft circle?! -in civilian areas?!
    .
    I fear these warplanes will help turn the apparently supportive Libyan civilians against us– something more likely the longer we stay involved. Hate to sound all dooms-day-ish.. but how long before these “innocents” become “terrorists” and the desire to not have boots-on-the-ground is overwhelmed by “national security interests” (get the terrorists!!). I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t like the way this is going.

  • GivenUp

    Politically that is going to be very difficult, there has been so much commitment to keeping US (and other) troops from being deployed on the ground that going back on all that would require overwhelming justification that does not seem forthcoming. Also, the AC-130 is perhaps the next best thing to having troops on the ground and is terrifyingly precise. It is also equipped with state of the art cameras which means that it is easy to spend time observing in detail what is going on before anyone shoots at anything. There are some youtube videos of the real deal in operation, as destructive as it is it is much preferable to all other alternatives and would probably be better able to avoid civilian deaths than other types of air-strikes.

  • gysgt213

    “If workers were interested in union representation they would have it.”
    .
    and better pay and benefits too. Guess they are not interested in that either.

  • paulejb

    gysgt213@9.9,
    .
    Apparently not. Since union membership in the private sector is down to 11.9%. That should tell you something about worker’s faith in unions.

  • hippooath

    “Apparently not. Since union membership in the private sector is down to 11.9%. That should tell you something about worker’s faith in unions.”
    .
    More to the effect of union busting.

  • formerlyjames

    WTH does red midst maker mean?

  • http://shortplaysaboutrealpeople.wordpress.com Michael Maiello

    I think Pinto is right here. Didn’t expect to see planes operating at such low altitudes. If one of these gets shot down, it could be cause for the first ground troops. Then we’re in a mess.

  • paulejb

    formerlyjames@14,
    .
    Ever see any of the Texas Chainsaw Massacre movies? That should give you an idea what red-mist means.

  • paulejb

    hippooath@7.4,
    .
    No union busting necessary. It was a conscious choice of the American worker. They choose not to join unions or vote to unionize their industries.

  • pintortwo

    Actually Michael, GivenUp, a US plane did already go down in Libya and a rescue team was inserted. One of the pilots was found by rebel forces.
    .
    In fact, it is alleged that the rescue helicopter fired warning shots– and injured 6 of them.
    .
    It is not hard to imagine another rescue going horribly wrong. What if the rebels returned fire? or if Gaddafi loyalists capture one of our pilots? (how would we even know the difference?) How long before one of our planes is shot down? -what kind of reaction could we expect from the media and congressional hawks then?
    .
    What happens when we mistakenly pulverize a civilian compound (bound to happen, unfortunately) and Libyan TV shows images of children being pulled from the wreckage? The Libyans might start to be less welcoming.. And isn’t that exactly the sort of thing terror groups would exploit to their advantage?
    .
    Point is, I can see a sequence of events where our commitment grows incrementally until we have soldiers on the ground facing off with a citizenry that resents them. Hey, the Iraqis were to welcome US liberators with candies and flowers… 8 years ago.

  • pintortwo
  • hippooath

    “No union busting necessary. It was a conscious choice of the American worker. They choose not to join unions or vote to unionize their industries.”
    .
    Right. Paule. Your ignorance is on the same level as RDW but with fewer words.

  • afguy

    WTH does red mist maker mean?
    .
    That may be a good description of what the GAU-8 on an A-10 would do if it hit a human being. 4k rounds per minute of 30mm HE or AP at 3600fpm velocity. Limited to 100 round bursts, if memory serves correctly.
    .
    But, at THAT velocity, ONE round might have that effect.

  • afguy

    The A-10 is about the lowest tech combat aircraft in the AF inventory.
    .
    An airframe built around a hydraulically-driven, mechanically-fired 30mm Gatling gun.

  • afguy

    The A-10 is actually a very interesting airplane – designed with the idea that it was going to get the tee-total dogsh!t shot out of it and still be able to fly. A throwback.
    .
    Simplest flight controls known, ability to keep flying with most of one wing gone or controls on one side unuseable.
    .
    It was designed to fly low and never intended to avoid ground fire. Entire cockpit area titanium armor-plated.

  • paulejb

    hippooath@7.6,
    .
    Okay, Hippo. The balls in your court. Prove that my statement was incorrect. It’s time for one of you geniuses to actually produce a rebuttal that is not a gratuitous insult.
    .
    Let’s see if you can do it, sparky.

  • hippooath

    “Okay, Hippo. The balls in your court. Prove that my statement was incorrect. It’s time for one of you geniuses to actually produce a rebuttal that is not a gratuitous insult.
    .
    Let’s see if you can do it, sparky.”
    .
    You made the statement – prove your own statement. That’s how it works.
    .
    You think calling you ignorant is a insult? It’s a fact based on that you ignore when anyone shows you wrong. Instead you simply repeat the same garbage the day after, the week after etc while dancing around calling yourself clever.
    .
    That’s being ignorant. Doubling down on it is just being willful.
    .
    ‘Dude’ – all you have is someone elses oneliners. You are shallow pond when it comes to clever and information. Most of what you present your ideologue brethren have already posted here (months and years ago) and we’ve already shown how wrong they are.
    .
    You know why there are fewer unions in this country? Because traditional union jobs are being shipped to Mexico and China (amongst others), not because the workers chosed to remove them. And other places with large workforces such as Wal-Mart have a active union busting core of lawyers that make sure that this doesn’t happen.
    .
    Those are the facts; yours is the fallacy that a person would chose to work more for less because the idea of having job security and safety in a workplace is such a bummer.

  • afguy

    Hey, paulie, here’s an interesting concept..
    .
    Instead of asking everyone to prove a negative, how about proving you’re the one that’s RIGHT with some links and proof of your own?
    .
    You’re the one making these grand statements of fact. Prove it.

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